In this episode of Event Experience by Bizzabo, host Rachel Moore speaks with Dawn Farrow, founder of On Sale Group, about the realities of marketing live experiences in today’s attention economy.
Dawn shares her unconventional path from performer to agency founder and the lessons she learned building a marketing agency dedicated to live events. The conversation explores what makes event marketing uniquely challenging, convincing audiences to spend time and money on experiences they don’t technically “need.”
Rachel and Dawn also discuss how marketers are navigating major shifts in advertising, ticketing legislation, and emerging technologies like AI. In today’s landscape, event marketers must go far beyond creative execution; they analyze data, adapt quickly to uncertainty, and often forecast trends to keep campaigns effective.
Dawn also highlights the importance of community within the event marketing profession. She encourages marketers to build strong peer networks through industry groups and in-person events. She also shares how her WhatsApp community, newsletter, and the Global Institute of Experience Marketing help support professionals working in the fast-evolving experience economy.
Rachel: [00:01:00] Welcome back everyone for a new episode of Event Experience by Bizzabo.
Rachel: I am your host Rachel Moore, and today's guest is described by Exhibition News as the accidental architect of a live experience revolution. I'm intrigued to hope you are as well. She is a marketing expert who has sold over 36 million tickets across theater, immersive events, attractions, and live experiences.
Rachel: She's the founder of On Sale Group, which runs the industry leading on sale, live conference, and the new Global Institute of Experience Marketing with a career that's taken her from dancer to agency founder to multi-business leader. She brings a refreshing, honest perspective on the realities of marketing and the attention economy and building a career in the fast growing, high pressure live experience industry.
Rachel: We can all relate with that. My guest today is Dawn Farrow. Dawn, thanks so much for joining us on [00:02:00] the podcast.
Dawn: Wow, that was amazing, and thank you for the invitation today, Rachel.
Rachel: It's excellent to have you on. I'm so excited. Now listen, I just gave a super brief intro of you and I wanna make sure our guests really get an idea of who you are because that was just not enough to cover it. I mean, we kind of touched all the high points, but I wanna toss it back to you, Dawn.
Rachel: Could you like, just give us a little bit more about your self and your role, what kind of your day-to-day world is like? I'm gonna hand it back over to you. Tell us more about yourself.
Dawn: Yeah. Well, what a great place to start. So firstly, the I'm speaking to you today from London, which is where the revolution that I'm told I am leading is happening from, I suppose in this scenario. And my day-to-day life is split between building On Sale Group, which is a startup. We began literally earlier in 2025, and also my consultancy work and my consultancy work and my new business On Sale Group live [00:03:00] absolutely in this same experience economy. The attention economy, and my job ultimately is either to sell tickets and build brands for live experiences or indeed to support the workforce and every bit, all the other sales and marketing experts who are doing exactly the same, which I do through one sale group.
Rachel: Excellent. I love that, that, and it sounds like you have a busy day, which I think all of our audience can can relate to even if we're not running, you know, multiple entities and things like that. But there's a lot of aspects about this I cannot wait for us to dig into. Before we do we do have a few personal kind of get to know you questions so we can get a little better sense of you as a person.
Rachel: First of all, I'm gonna ask a question that I think all of our audience relates to on a regular basis because events people whatever your role might be, there's probably gonna be some long days on your feet in store for you. So when that happens Dawn, what are your go-to on the ground [00:04:00] event day shoes that you like to wear?
Dawn: I am a trainer girl through and through and oh, sneakers, I suppose, actually correcting myself. And I particularly love really loud, brightly colored. I have an amazing pair of silver trainers that I just adore that probably have seen the best days, but always sneakers.
Rachel: I am so glad. I think the whole industry is glad too, that that's a thing that we can do. We don't have to be wearing heels or dress shoes that sneakers can be cool and even professional. So I love that you do that. Thank you for that great recommendation. Everybody remember loud, you can go there.
Rachel: I do too. So I. You're my spirit animal right now. I love that. Is there anything that you are listening to, watching or reading these days that you can't put down, and it doesn't have to be events related.
Dawn: Oh, well, I have to say I was invited [00:05:00] to a book club recently and I just thought, gosh, how amazing. And then I realized that maybe because I'm running two businesses right now, I haven't picked up a book for a really long time and it really made me think like, what am I actually, what am I reading?
Dawn: And I tell you what I'm reading, my WhatsApp's going nuts. what I'm mainly, yeah, like, I mean, we'll talk, I'm sure we'll talk about it Rachel, but from my community that I'm building to communicating with clients to life, to, you know, all of those, I read a lot of WhatsApps in a day, so, uh, top tip.
Dawn: Yeah. Read your WhatsApps.
Rachel: I'm a big fan of WhatsApp. I remember that. I, I've had it as an app on my phone. I wanna say it's been almost 10 years now. I think it, but especially as someone, and I love that you mentioned you're joining from London. I'm in a United States, but I found it to be a a wonderful way to stay in touch with people, especially across the pond, but also just people who are domestically local to you.
Rachel: I love that as a and it's got groups. You can do private [00:06:00] communities in there. I even think. And y'all, I know I'm going on a tangent here, I promise we'll get back to the next question here in a second. But I think even like, Nike or someone like used it, like for their VIP they would have a VIP group of customers in a WhatsApp and they used that to like test out their product and things.
Rachel: So from a marketing standpoint, even it's a great, it's a great tool. it's the first time I think we've able, able to be like, Hey, WhatsApp is really cool. So thanks for bringing that up. I also spend a lot of time in WhatsApp, so I love that. Is there a particular social post or a piece of media or even a hot take about events that you might have found interesting lately?
Dawn: I think the really important hot take that we are talking about in London, and I actually think it's something in the US you have recently been through. But we have just had confirmation of a major piece of new ticketing legislation, which will undoubtedly change everything about the way we advertise our ticket [00:07:00] prices.
Dawn: And it is so huge that the repercussions and the work involved in getting us to a place where we follow the legislation is going to be it, it will take months and we will get there, but it really, I think many of us are just trying to get our head around what we have been doing and what we now have to do,
Rachel: Yeah. Wow. If anyone is still remembers, which was pretty recent actually, when you think about it GDPR becoming a thing. I mean, even here in United. States was California adopted similar rules that really, at least for the marketing sector, but there's so many aspects of it too, where we're like, oh, we have to change and comply.
Rachel: So, yeah, I love that you bring that up, that's obviously gonna be very front of mind for people, because when it's something that's legal. You kind of need to make sure you hop onto it and make sure you're adapting. So I think that's so important. Well, wonderful. Thank you for letting us know a little bit more about you and giving us some more [00:08:00] insights.
Rachel: Let's dig into like what we're gonna talk about today.
Rachel: One of my favorite experiences when with hosting this show is when we do get to dabble a little bit deeper into a topic and expertise that's close to my own heart. I'm a marketer for of 18 years, just about. And so I I love that I get to talk to you today.
Rachel: Your expertise lies specifically in, and I love this, y'all, this is in quotation marks, but I love the wording of this "Marketing in the attention economy?"
Rachel: Which considering attention spans these days might cause all of us to cringe. We're like, "Oh gosh, the attention economy really is there even any attention?"
Rachel: So let me throw this to you, how is marketing experiences unique from like garden variety marketing? Like, we talked about Nike and whatever like that, but how is marketing experiences a unique tactic, a unique approach from what we might think of as traditional marketing of other things?
Dawn: Yeah. Well, I think the first thing to say is that the toolbox that we're [00:09:00] playing with is exactly the same. So whether you are marketing experiences or you are marketing Coca-Cola, we all have the same tools available to us. We then have to think about, okay, but what are the differences? One of the first things to say is that you don't need anything that I am selling.
Dawn: So you're never going to get thirsty and, you know, need to buy a ticket. You might get thirsty and want a Coca-Cola. And that alone is this incredible sweet spot of understanding of oh, okay, so how will I sell? How will I build the brand to get people to come? And in that scenario, marketing in the attention economy is probably the hardest type of marketing you will ever fall into ever. Yeah. And. When we overlay that with I guess very macro economic situations and quite a lot of unsteadiness [00:10:00] around the world at the moment, it becomes even harder to sell. What we do from a selling, live selling tickets because you don't need it.
Dawn: So very often we talk about, the first thing to go, you know, when we're struggling with money, little is what our disposable income is like we begin to reduce it. We make sure we've got enough for bills and you know, all the key things. And then we already can see that discretionary spend is reducing.
Dawn: That's really interesting because actually it's set against these incredible projections, this forecasting for the experience economy as a whole, which says that I think the latest figures say that by 2028, the experience economy will be worth $12 trillion,
Rachel: Whoa.
Dawn: which is mind blown. Now, i'm conscious that within the attention, within that experience economy phrasing, we can include sport and we can absolutely include hospitality.
Dawn: But what's interesting is that they all involve tickets that are all [00:11:00] event-based and they are all live experiences and when, and that none of them, I could argue we need them to fill our souls. And I'm sure you would agree with me, Rachel but actually for Joe Public, you don't need what we are selling.
Dawn: And so, the toolbox may be the same, but the appetite and the skills and also the budget very different.
Rachel Moore: We'll be right back with more event experience after the break
From backstage to the spotlight, The Event Experience Podcast by Bizzabo gives you a front row seat to the event industry's most captivating stories. Want to get more out of each episode? Visit bizzabo.com/podcast. That's B I Z Z A B O dot com forward slash podcast for show notes, transcripts, links, and resources mentioned in each episode and more. The Event Experience Podcast by Bizzabo where events become unforgettable experiences.
Rachel Moore: [00:12:00] We're back with event experience to talk about our favorite thing as event marketers. Tickets and registrations.
Rachel: You hit on this thing. And again, love language of marketers because that is all our whole bread and butter, is that we are in the business of convincing people through a lot of feelings. and there, thus that impacts their decisions that, oh maybe a want is a need.
Rachel: Y'all, this is not new. I mean, there's gonna always be things happening in history and society, in geopolitical, in economic circles in everything where that's going to impact. How that needle moves for that person, if it's a want or a need.
Rachel: And then if, you know, if it is something like what their investment's gonna be in it. And I mentioned there, I'd mentioned feelings there because I think this segues into my next question for you because there are challenges around, like you just described, in probably harder challenges than other things where event planners are contending with, [00:13:00] those pain points. And how is that particular, like you said, Joe Public, what is their, you know, budget looking like? What are their personal decisions looking like per personal and professional? What is their situation in life? So I wanna ask you this question.
Rachel: What are some of those main challenges that event planners are contending with as far as trying to market tickets and registrations these days?
Rachel: Plus, if you have solutions for overcoming those challenges, we'd love to hear those too. But yeah, what challenges are they facing specifically?
Dawn: I think the first challenge. Directly comes back to this idea of growth and this forecasting that, you know, that those figures I was just sharing. Because what's interesting about that is that we're not just talking about more shows on Broadway or more immersive experiences in London.
Dawn: What we're talking about is a are multiple, multiple nuances of types of experience. I mean, it could be dining in the dark [00:14:00] holding hands with a cat and a, and I'm buying a ticket, right? I'll probably get asked to market it, but do you see like, like the nuances? So there's this explosion in how you and what you can go and see is extraordinary.
Dawn: And I think that is problematic for many marketers because all of a sudden it's not comedy. It's not an arena show. It's not theater it's right, and it's so, it's sort of some of it in between and often in a venue you've never heard of and you dunno how to get there. Right.
Dawn: That we get a lot of that as well. So I think there is this challenge about speed of growth, which is exciting, but in contrast to, how do I explain what it is? Because if the consumer doesn't get understand it immediately, you've already lost them. And we, we know how briefly people will look at advertising content.
Dawn: I think the other challenge which sort of [00:15:00] moves on from that point is this idea that you need to be ready, you need to have enough advertising running so that when the consumer is ready, you are still front of mind. And that's a bit like being a consultant and always making sure you're putting content out on LinkedIn and you think, oh God, no one's seen it and no one ever engages.
Dawn: And then eventually someone picks up the phone and they go, oh, want to engage you? And you feel like it's come from nowhere, but actually it's because you've been doing a year's worth of your incredible LinkedIn content. And it's the same with advertising our experiences. It's that always on part of your campaign.
Dawn: And the challenge there, of course is not only ensuring great content that when you are serving it, it's entertaining, but also that you have enough budget to keep it running. And all of this set against a moment in time where, we've seen lots of changes across meta in the last year in a downturn, and we are seeing, you know, paid Google [00:16:00] spend not convert in the same way because of AI.
Dawn: I mean, it's you know, I think there's sort of the challenges are set against exciting, but interesting sort of technology and revolution of how we use technology.
Rachel: Again, marketers speak here too, but I'm so glad you brought up that changing landscape of advertising. And y'all, you know, some of you listening to this, I mean, if you get budget for paid promotions for what you're trying to get people to register for by tickets for, that's great.
Rachel: You know, I think we all love that, but a lot of people are even are doing organic, but they all face the same kind of problem. Is because all of this change in search and how ads and posts and feeds are getting delivered, getting the algorithms are people even seeing what you're putting out there?
Rachel: You know, are you still getting the same bang for your buck? No, you're not. You know, it's, it's adjusted and so you're having to pivot with that as well and contend with that. So I'm really glad you brought that up. 'cause that is a universal [00:17:00] that obviously in this attention economy is hitting the experience industry, but it's certainly hitting others as well.
Rachel: We're all fighting it and we're all competing and trying to, like, who's gonna hack it first, you know, and who's gonna win that day? So, I'm really glad 'cause yeah, that, that is a major pain point.
Rachel: I wanna get into this next one too, this question because I think that some event planners, we always try to focus on the positive, but let's get real here. We are struggling. You know, there are times we're struggling, event planners, event marketers. We're not getting the registrations that we used to get or that we hope to get. We have a goal, we set out to hit it and we're not hitting it.
Rachel: Or we're selling tickets, we're like, we need to sell this many. We have promised our sponsors, we promised the vendors. We promised our internal sales team and operations and leadership that we were going to hit this number and we're not hitting it. And so, what do you think might be a major misconception that event planners or marketers have about, well, here's why I'm not hitting those registration numbers.
Rachel: Here's why I am [00:18:00] not selling the tickets that I was hoping to sell. What do you think they're believing about that might be wrong?
Dawn: Mm. I think it's a two part answer, and I actually think the first part of the answer is not about the marketers, it's actually about the what I would describe as the producers or the promoters or the owners of the particular event. And that for me the challenge I see there, the misconception is the idea that marketing is there to make things look pretty. And I have grown up, you know, I am well past my mid forties and. Have been doing this since I was in my early twenties.
Dawn: And in my early twenties. I love nothing more than looking at a poster, oh, I mean, happy days. Just thinking about what size the text could be and where to put the theater venue name. I mean, look, I mean, it just sort of makes me smile.
Dawn: The hours spent genuinely making things [00:19:00] look pretty because, and just testing can you see that text from a distance? Yes. Yes. Can see. Right. there's this idea that yeah, that's what I did. Yeah. You know, pretty 20-year-old girl did marketing or communications. I mean, absolute classic. Fast forward and if our promoters are still thinking like that you are already in trouble, I would say run.
Dawn: If that, you know, like, don't take that gig. I don't care how much you think you need that don't take it 'cause the budget will be small and you will never win. My job has changed unlike yours. I'm sure Rachel, I unrecognizably. Like, do I get to look at things and make sure they look pretty? Sure It is that much of my day?
Dawn: No, I don't have time to, you know, worry about, you know, like I think about it. Will it perform? Do I think the content hits home? Absolutely. Absolutely different way of thinking. So, so that's my first, and then I think it's because we have been in this, this world where perhaps [00:20:00] marketing has been misunderstood.
Dawn: I think that what you then get from the marketers is this idea of perhaps not being confident in their decisions, and I have built a whole community of people who, many of whom. All of whom want to learn more about their craft, but many of whom are actually, I would reflect, like we just want to know what we're doing the right thing.
Dawn: We want to feel like it's okay to test and learn. We want to feel like it's okay to sometimes fail because nobody has all the right answers. And I think the misconception there is that you should somehow just know, right? And people come to you seeking answers and I think you think oh gosh.
Dawn: Okay. What is the answer? It must be really clear. There must be a sum I can do to work out that CPA that is just guaranteed. Yep. It's gonna be this many dollars. Uh, I mean, I don't know. I don't know till we [00:21:00] start actually. And it's almost like having the confidence to say. I think based on what you've told me and the budget that is available, it will be between here
Rachel: Yes.
Dawn: and therefore, so will my ability be to hit that target that you are giving me, which is not based on any data and sales patterns that I would like to advise you on.
Dawn: It is based on a financial, like we need to hit this. It's, yeah, it's a crazy time Rachel.
Rachel: I, I am.
Dawn: I, um.
Rachel: You have just hit too, and this segues perfectly and you mentioned it already in your answer, just some of the histrionics that we marketers can go through very validly because we're just like, oh my gosh, I'm working with this stuff. I'm working with very little information, little data. And again, and I, I love that you've, you've also mentioned the word forecast a few times in some of your answers, and we do feel like weather forecasters, where we're like, well best guess going forward. But we also don't have [00:22:00] control over everything do we Like and I live in Colorado, which is a very key area for this. The weather changes every 20 minutes, so being a forecaster here, but that's what marketers often are, is we're not just here to make things pretty.
Rachel: Of course we do make things look glorious, but we're here to do so much more.
Rachel: And I do wanna give you the opportunity here because anyone who has been a fan of this podcast knows that community is a major component of event experience success. We've had guest after guest over the last few years talk about how important community is to live experiences to events, and that they often help drive all that, all those goals every event after event and time after time.
Rachel: And it's vital to the people who put on these events and market them. So please, I would love to hear more about this community. Tell us more about building that marketing community across the experience economy and even better, how we could be a part of it potentially.
Dawn: Yeah, great. As you'd mentioned at the beginning, actually, I had built a very successful marketing [00:23:00] agency and I, I closed that just before this little thing called a pandemic.
Dawn: And I swore that I would never. I don't need another business. Like that was hard, really hard. I will do is consult and it will be lovely and much more straightforward. Anyway. I'm terrible at sitting still too long. And I also found that through my consultancy work, whilst I loved it, it was actually very isolating.
Dawn: And I began in very confusing times in terms of ticketing and sales patterns. And I began to reach out to a few people who were. Like myself or indeed, they were actually working in big businesses or in agencies and we were all feeling the same. And I suddenly wondered, could, is there a way to bring people together?
Dawn: Like would, if I felt like it would help me, perhaps it would help others. Long story short, in March this year, I sent my first email out to, I don't want anyone to be jealous here. 66 people. [00:24:00] A big 66 and I think I sold about three tickets on the day for my Conex. That happens every May. Called on, I say every May.
Dawn: It's happened once, but it is happening in 2026 in May as well. And we now have I mean that email database is in its hundreds, but what we also have is a WhatsApp community. Which is an incredibly positive. I mean, there's the joy of marketing people. They can do, they're positive, they crack on. We don't have time to be complaining.
Rachel: So Dawn I have the easiest question of all now. Where can our listeners find and follow you online?
Dawn: So we have a WhatsApp community. We have the newsletter, and both can be found through onsale.live. And if you would like to follow me on social media, I'm dawn.onsalegroup on Instagram.
Rachel Moore: [00:25:00] Dawn's skill up suggestion for event marketers is to tap into the power of networking.
Dawn: I would say anybody at any point in your career, so whether you're just starting out or whether perhaps you've been doing it like we have a really long time, the best thing to do is to get outta the office, get out of your home, get with people. Like you don't even have to like force yourself to network, right?
Dawn: Like, but just get your body out in and into a space where you can hear great things being talked about in an industry that you love. And so many people are uncomfortable with networking and I that is absolutely okay. Right. But when you are in spaces with people that are doing a similar job to you that are.
Dawn: Interesting, that inspiring or some that you think are very dull, right? At least you get the chance to go. I'm not sure I agree with them, but [00:26:00] if you are sat at home, you'll never get to have that opinion. I run the Global Institute of Experience Marketing, which we run a masterclass on a face-to-face.
Dawn: It's in London, a one day masterclass, and we cover AI ticketing. The future of advertising and customer psychology when it comes to buying a ticket. And I have been asked many times that will, that go online? And I have to say for now, I can't do it online because I have to get 20 people.
Dawn: It's tiny, like small group training. Like we've got to be in a space together like the profound learning that you do by being with people in that way, like you just, it, it's literally priceless.
Rachel Moore: Thanks again to Dawn Farrow for joining us on event experience, and thank you for listening.
Rachel Moore: If you're enjoying the show, we'd love to hear about it. Connect with us on social and subscribe, rate, and review us wherever you're listening. Also, don't forget to share the show with your colleagues and [00:27:00] friends. You can find transcripts of each episode and key takeaways on bizzabo.com/podcast. On behalf of the team, thank you.
Rachel Moore: We'll gather again soon for a new episode of Event Experience.
